How/Why/When of Initial Contact w/ ATC (A look at COC)

Brin Brody

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Re: How/Why/When of Initial Contact w/ ATC (A look at COC)
« Reply #30 on: March 17, 2017, 01:09:49 pm »
While Daniel is correct, I'll admit that I never found it worth the time/effort to deselect my primary frequency tx...  No biggie to me if my pilots see me ask someone to contact me on my frequency.  In the RW, it's the same transmission they'd be hearing if they were "good pilots" and monitoring the guard frequency in one of their other COM radios..... ;)

I do it all the time... Unfortunately with not too great response rates.  I'd say around 1/4 pilots are on frequency when I do the call, unfortunately leading to the .contactme command.  It's the unfortunate truth of VATSIM; we don't require pilots to be certified to fly online, so we can't expect anywhere near perfection.
Brin Brody
Deputy Air Traffic Manager
Jacksonville ARTCC
datm@zjxartcc.org


Joe VanMeter

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Re: How/Why/When of Initial Contact w/ ATC (A look at COC)
« Reply #31 on: March 17, 2017, 09:32:05 pm »
On an unrelated note, I wonder how many (if any) "average joe" pilots around the network are reading this thread. The question isn't what does the COC say, it's why don't many pilots know that they are supposed to be aware of the rules. What's the point of spending all that time writing rules if nobody is going to be required to follow them?

I've always been of the opinion new members should have to pass an exam on the PRC material and at the end of that exam it should advertise the various ATO's and encourage them to seek out Pilot ratings. I believe it would really help this network in both pilot quality and general knowledge of the rules etc.

I have been following this thread and I have to agree with Ryan that new pilots should have some sort of exam to be able to fly on the network. Last time I checked wasn't the P1 rating just a test based on the PRC and was administered through vatsim? If this was the cause maybe we could require pilots to have a P1 rating to fly and give them options to pursue furthing ratings if they choose to?
Joe VanMeter
Deputy Air Traffic Manager
vZID ARTCC

Re: How/Why/When of Initial Contact w/ ATC (A look at COC)
« Reply #32 on: March 18, 2017, 07:55:30 am »
Mandatory P1 training or pilot certification is something that would have to be approved by the VATSIM Board of Governors, and there's an active discussion on the topic on the VATSIM forums (and many dozens of inactive ones too).  Discussing it here isn't going to change anything.
Don Desfosse
Vice President, Membership, VATSIM
Division Director Emeritus, VATUSA

Re: How/Why/When of Initial Contact w/ ATC (A look at COC)
« Reply #33 on: March 18, 2017, 07:59:03 am »
While Daniel is correct, I'll admit that I never found it worth the time/effort to deselect my primary frequency tx...  No biggie to me if my pilots see me ask someone to contact me on my frequency.  In the RW, it's the same transmission they'd be hearing if they were "good pilots" and monitoring the guard frequency in one of their other COM radios..... ;)

I do it all the time... Unfortunately with not too great response rates.  I'd say around 1/4 pilots are on frequency when I do the call, unfortunately leading to the .contactme command.
When you say you "do it", do you mean attempt to hail pilots on your frequency, on unicom, or both?  If you mean your frequency, that's why I was suggesting unicom.  If your pilots don't respond to you on unicom, then the pilots are in violation of BOTH sections B3 and B7 of the Code of Conduct, and you are entirely within your right to contact a Supervisor (and/or use the .contactme crutch).  Whether you choose to do that or not is up to your facility policies and/or personal preference.
Don Desfosse
Vice President, Membership, VATSIM
Division Director Emeritus, VATUSA

Shane VanHoven

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Re: How/Why/When of Initial Contact w/ ATC (A look at COC)
« Reply #34 on: March 22, 2017, 11:28:30 am »
Mandatory P1 training or pilot certification is something that would have to be approved by the VATSIM Board of Governors, and there's an active discussion on the topic on the VATSIM forums (and many dozens of inactive ones too).  Discussing it here isn't going to change anything.

Let's be honest, discussing it there isn't going to change anything, either. ;)
Shane VanHoven
Minneapolis ARTCC, VATUSA ACE Team | Instructor
Private pilot, Instrument, ASEL
FAA Air Traffic Developmental, Terminal

Brin Brody

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Re: How/Why/When of Initial Contact w/ ATC (A look at COC)
« Reply #35 on: March 23, 2017, 10:23:07 am »
While Daniel is correct, I'll admit that I never found it worth the time/effort to deselect my primary frequency tx...  No biggie to me if my pilots see me ask someone to contact me on my frequency.  In the RW, it's the same transmission they'd be hearing if they were "good pilots" and monitoring the guard frequency in one of their other COM radios..... ;)

I do it all the time... Unfortunately with not too great response rates.  I'd say around 1/4 pilots are on frequency when I do the call, unfortunately leading to the .contactme command.
When you say you "do it", do you mean attempt to hail pilots on your frequency, on unicom, or both?  If you mean your frequency, that's why I was suggesting unicom.  If your pilots don't respond to you on unicom, then the pilots are in violation of BOTH sections B3 and B7 of the Code of Conduct, and you are entirely within your right to contact a Supervisor (and/or use the .contactme crutch).  Whether you choose to do that or not is up to your facility policies and/or personal preference.

My steps:
  • Hail on Frequency
  • .contactme
  • Private Message
  • Wallop (If Necessary)

Isn't ATC participation on UNICOM against the CoC or is that something I've messed up?
Brin Brody
Deputy Air Traffic Manager
Jacksonville ARTCC
datm@zjxartcc.org


Re: How/Why/When of Initial Contact w/ ATC (A look at COC)
« Reply #36 on: March 23, 2017, 11:21:14 am »
It's not against any section of the CoC.
Don Desfosse
Vice President, Membership, VATSIM
Division Director Emeritus, VATUSA

Brin Brody

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Re: How/Why/When of Initial Contact w/ ATC (A look at COC)
« Reply #37 on: March 24, 2017, 08:29:44 pm »
It's not against any section of the CoC.

Thanks.  This opens a door for contact I hadn't thought was possible...  :D
Brin Brody
Deputy Air Traffic Manager
Jacksonville ARTCC
datm@zjxartcc.org