UNICOM a talking frequency?

[Kyle Beamsderfer]

I;m not sure if this belongs here, as this is my first post, but I have been thinking lately: If we are trying to emulate real-world flying and ATC procedures, would it be possible to make the UNICOM frequency 122.8 a talking frequency? I would like to see us announce intentions on an actual voice channel rather that having to type everything. Is this a possibility in the near or distant future?

[Jon Stoops]

I;m not sure if this belongs here, as this is my first post, but I have been thinking lately: If we are trying to emulate real-world flying and ATC procedures, would it be possible to make the UNICOM frequency 122.8 a talking frequency? I would like to see us announce intentions on an actual voice channel rather that having to type everything. Is this a possibility in the near or distant future?

Bandwidth

[Daniel Hawton]

Bandwidth

Not so much.

The reason UNICOM is text only under squawkbox is that under network regs you still have to type on UNICOM.  Not everyone on VATSIM can receive voice, so text is required so they can "benefit" from UNICOM as well.  FSInn allows you to use voice on UNICOM, however, you also have to type your intentions on UNICOM as well so that text only pilots are able to see it.  There are some users who are deaf, so they would be unable to hear you announce that you're landing on runway 17R and they taxi into position for departure on the same runway because you used voice over text, for example.

[Kyle Beamsderfer]

Not so much.

The reason UNICOM is text only under squawkbox is that under network regs you still have to type on UNICOM.  Not everyone on VATSIM can receive voice, so text is required so they can "benefit" from UNICOM as well.  FSInn allows you to use voice on UNICOM, however, you also have to type your intentions on UNICOM as well so that text only pilots are able to see it.  There are some users who are deaf, so they would be unable to hear you announce that you're landing on runway 17R and they taxi into position for departure on the same runway because you used voice over text, for example.

Well yeah, but we can provide the option of Voice or text, like we do for control frequencies no?

[Daniel Hawton]

Well yeah, but we can provide the option of Voice or text, like we do for control frequencies no?

No, you can't.  Pilots who are text only cannot hear voice.  On control frequencies, you are communicating with 1 person, the controller, or vica versa.  If the controller is text only, pilots have to use text.  If the controller is both, then a pilot can choose voice or text.  If a pilot is text and conflicts with a voice pilot, the controller SHOULD be issuing a traffic call via text to the text pilot and voice to the voice pilot so both aircraft are aware of each other.  On UNICOM, you are communicating with everyone in the area.  There is no way to communicate with everyone in the area on UNICOM on VATSIM via voice OR text.  You either have to: A) Use both or  use text to ensure that everyone sees/hears it.

[Matthew Bartels]

Search voice unicom on the vatsim fourms and tell me what you find

[Scott DeWoody]

Search voice unicom on the vatsim fourms and tell me what you find

Matthew, is that a trick question?  Because Daniel is absolutely correct in his explaination of the voice/text unicom issue.

[Brad Littlejohn]

There is one more, albeit minor reason why Unicom is text.

Range.

Think about it. 122.8 used everywhere in the US (keeping it regional, for the bounds of this forum). I'm at KPRX (uncontrolled field). I connect to a voice-enabled UNICOM channel on, say, rw.liveatc.net (one of the more popular voice servers we have). I notice some 75 other pilots on there as well, announcing their intentions at Rapid City, Boise, Erie, Duluth, Santa Fe, St. George, and Cheyenne). Absolutely none of them are near me, so why should I have to deal with hearing their intentions when I'm in Northeastern Texas? None of them are near eachother as well!

There is no way to control range on a voice server. And that brings up another point: What if I connected to the VATPAC voice server, while someone else at the same airport as me connects to the LiveATC server? I won't hear them, and they won't hear me. He starts his takeoff roll as I do, at opposite ends of the field.... You see what happens.

Text is at least covered by range, and does not provide that conflict that voice servers would.

BL.

[Brian Pryor]

Unicom defaults to the liveatc server if I remember right. To do a voice server on any of the others you'd have to connect via a VVL channel.

The boundaries for the range seems tied closely to what facility you are in with some degree of error as there isn't an exact square.

[Brad Littlejohn]

Unicom defaults to the liveatc server if I remember right. To do a voice server on any of the others you'd have to connect via a VVL channel.

The boundaries for the range seems tied closely to what facility you are in with some degree of error as there isn't an exact square.

Which is completely fine for text, but not so for voice. So I say again: if you're connected to the liveATC voice server, and I'm connected to the UK voice server, and we are both at the same field, who hears whose intentions over voice?

There have been many a time when I've preferred to connect to the OCEANIA server over any US server mainly because of load and lag in response times. And while that isn't a problem (like you said, the range is tied to the facility you are in), voice does not have that restriction. I could even connect to a voice server closest to me, and still hear callouts not relative to, let alone near my physical location. That's what makes voice UNICOM hard in this situation.

BL.

[Daniel Hawton]

Which is completely fine for text, but not so for voice. So I say again: if you're connected to the liveATC voice server, and I'm connected to the UK voice server, and we are both at the same field, who hears whose intentions over voice?

There have been many a time when I've preferred to connect to the OCEANIA server over any US server mainly because of load and lag in response times. And while that isn't a problem (like you said, the range is tied to the facility you are in), voice does not have that restriction. I could even connect to a voice server closest to me, and still hear callouts not relative to, let alone near my physical location. That's what makes voice UNICOM hard in this situation.

BL.

OCEANIA has nothing to do with what voice server you are on.  The servers tell FSInn/Squawkbox, iirc, what server to connect to for UNICOM and voiceroom.  So unless you specifically set FSInn/Squawkbox to connect over to the UK server, it will default to whatever the servers tell the client to connect to.

[Brad Littlejohn]

OCEANIA has nothing to do with what voice server you are on.  The servers tell FSInn/Squawkbox, iirc, what server to connect to for UNICOM and voiceroom.  So unless you specifically set FSInn/Squawkbox to connect over to the UK server, it will default to whatever the servers tell the client to connect to.

This goes to further prove my point, Daniel. If I am at an uncontrolled field (say, KHHW), and connect to the UK server, by your reckoning, I should get some default voice channel on some arbitrarily selected voice server as given per my connection to the UK server. Some other person decides to also fly out of KHHW, and connects to the USA-N server, and gets some other default voice channel on some other arbitrarily selected voice server. How does that other pilot and I communicate over UNICOM, via voice?

We won't, because we won't hear eachother, because we are on two separate servers completely. On top of that, what is stopping some other pilot who connected to the UK server from announcing their intentions as they depart EGCC or EINN, while I am in Oklahoma?

BL.

[Daniel Hawton]

This goes to further prove my point, Daniel. If I am at an uncontrolled field (say, KHHW), and connect to the UK server, by your reckoning, I should get some default voice channel on some arbitrarily selected voice server as given per my connection to the UK server. Some other person decides to also fly out of KHHW, and connects to the USA-N server, and gets some other default voice channel on some other arbitrarily selected voice server. How does that other pilot and I communicate over UNICOM, via voice?

We won't, because we won't hear eachother, because we are on two separate servers completely. On top of that, what is stopping some other pilot who connected to the UK server from announcing their intentions as they depart EGCC or EINN, while I am in Oklahoma?

BL.

It's not arbitrary.. they all point to the same voice server and room for UNICOM for that region.. at least that's what I've seen by looking at vox channels on the voice servers.  I haven't seen these "arbitrary assignments" based by what server the pilot is connecting to, but by the region they're flying in.

[Brad Littlejohn]

It's not arbitrary.. they all point to the same voice server and room for UNICOM for that region.. at least that's what I've seen by looking at vox channels on the voice servers.  I haven't seen these "arbitrary assignments" based by what server the pilot is connecting to, but by the region they're flying in.

Then we still run into problems, because none of the pilots would know where that region ends. Currently, I could stay on rw.liveatc.net, connected to the USA-N or USA-W2 server, and not once get switched over to anything VATPAC related, while flying to PGUM.

I'll have to check my settings in SB3 again to be sure on that, but I'm pretty sure we still have the potential of people not hearing other pilot's calls for any voice UNICOM because pilots couldn't know what voice server other pilots are on..

BL.

[Daniel Hawton]

Then we still run into problems, because none of the pilots would know where that region ends. Currently, I could stay on rw.liveatc.net, connected to the USA-N or USA-W2 server, and not once get switched over to anything VATPAC related, while flying to PGUM.

I'll have to check my settings in SB3 again to be sure on that, but I'm pretty sure we still have the potential of people not hearing other pilot's calls for any voice UNICOM because pilots couldn't know what voice server other pilots are on..

BL.

That's all handled internally... just like when you're on a center's frequency and they forget about you and you go outside their radio range.. you're automatically removed from that voice room.  You don't need to worry about the region, it's all handled internally.

In the end tho, text on UNICOM is what is required according to network regs.  So even if you broadcast intentions by voice, you'd have to turn around and do so again by text.  Waste of time.